A Wild Treedog Appears! (MOIII)

[Vera Silvertooth]

VERA

Vera! There you are! You're a sassy one, heehee. I think we found out who put that knife in Ginson's soup. Vera's smart, resourceful, and not above murdering a fort filled with beasts for stolen trinkets. I'm excited to see her in the contest. She seems like a super fun one for interactions.

I must say, I think you are the first reviewer who liked my app. The poor cooks seemed rather despised in the application process and I felt at first that I got in simply because I was the best of the worst. However, I've been informed that certain judges and readers now view me with more favor. :-)

I do hope I continue to bring enjoyment to you. Your thoughts thus far have been fun to read.

[Airan]

Discussion!

The one I was most disappointed that didn't make it in was Rail. Why? Because I honestly believe he was robbed due to his species choice. I've gone back and read the reviews on him, and while there were some who didn't focus on the dingo thing when it came to casting their votes (Matra and Vizon come to mind), there were a number of people that seemed to dismiss him simply because he chose a dingo, and that's sad.

The funny thing is, I read people thinking Rail chose his species as a gimmick, but he makes absolutely no mention of his dingo-ness throughout the entire app. He focuses on the character's mannerisms and personality. When you consider that, I'm not sure how much water the gimmick argument holds.

I think this is what personally did him in to be honest. From what I can tell from how he was received by the judges and the voters, it wasn't him being a dingo that anyone had a problem with, but rather that he made no mention of it at all and that, thus, it didn't necessarily add anything to the character. Him being a dingo just felt sort of thrown in.

Looking at Pasha, another non-canon species, it's impossible for her character to exist as any other species. Her personal plotline, mannerisms, and general alieness, wouldn't be able to function on anything but an iguana. Meanwhile, Rail's character could be put on any other species and it would still function exactly the same. Personally, I didn't mind Rail. I had knowledge of who the author was, and, having written with him before, I had faith that he could handle it quite well, but the audience of course didn't have that knowledge and were just left wondering "why?" It would be a risk to vote him in because no one necessarily knew what he was doing by playing the different species card or how well the writer would pull it off, unlike Pasha, who everyone knew exactly what they were getting when they voted for her.

At least those are my thoughts on why Rail wasn't too well received.

[Sycamore]

Ehh, I understand where you're coming from, but I stand by my argument that there were people who dismissed him simply for the species chosen:

I really, really, really wanted to dig him more. But alas, yes, he's a dingo, and yes, I can't agree with that. WHY? Why is he a dingo? I just can't bring myself to let a dingo, one who's specifically Australian for some reason, into the Redwall universe.

I don't know what to do. I like this app, but I don't like that he's a dingo. I really, really don't see why he has to be one.

Now, I could be missing context, I am revisiting these discussions about two months later, but what I see has led me to this conclusion.

You're absolutely right about Pasha. Her whole schtick revolves around her species. That's why I pulled her as an example of using her species as the gimmick. What I'm saying is that's not what Rail did, and what peeves me off is the fact that despite not using his species as a gimmick, people still cried foul over it:

I just kind of feel that the more exotic animals chosen are the author trying to lean on the cool gimmick rather than the strength of their own character, and that gives me less faith in their character too.

You do not have to choose an exotic species to stand out. It almost always comes across as cheap and gimmicky to me, which is a shame, because in every other aspect, I love Rail.

Now, I pose the question: How can choosing a particular species be a gimmick when the writer doesn't even address it? This is what I'm talking about throwing around a red gimmick card when it's completely unwarranted.

I do agree that it would have been nice for Rail to address his species. By all rights, he should have, because without the information at the top of the app, it's impossible to tell what he is. No, I don't think he should have revolved his app around it like Pasha did, and yes, there were people who needed that piece of information in order to sway their votes to him. As it stands, he did lose votes because people did not like the species chosen, and it was not because he didn't address it in the app.

[Airan]

Oh, no, you're certainly right. Rail lost votes because of his species, no doubt. But I largely believe it has to do with the fact that he didn't reference that he was a unique species at all. If he had said 'I'm a dingo and this is why" it would have probably been far more accepted. We had one application for a Pelican that didn't make 30, and it just had a quick line that basically said "Aye, I don't usually fly this far north. Got knocked off course and separated from my flock" and I was like "Okay, cool."

I'm personally more quick to call something a gimmick when it's not mentioned then when it is. Because Rail was a dingo, and made no mention as to why, voters were more quick to label it as a ploy to make Rail seem more special than what he was which may have led to distaste to the application. Instead of relying on Rail's character as a whole, being a dingo felt tacked on and pointless when he could have been any other creature.

Just reiterating btw: I actually liked Rail, I liked all the Navigators :P

[Sycamore]

The navigators were strong, definitely, and I agree with a lot of what was said about them. I am glad that Robert made it in, because his app was really well executed in terms of giving us a well developed character with goals, aspirations, and a background.

Rail might have missed some components in that, his history is fleeting with just a quick note of odd jobs he's had and a town named Allenport, but we know he's a drifter and he doesn't hold onto things for long. He lives in the moment; even his taste for apples changes depending on the day. We don't know where he's looking or what he means to be, but we do know he's content where he is right now. That can make for a fun character when he doesn't consider the repercussions of his actions.

I think his writing was great and the dialogue was absolutely superb. He's a character who lives more in the now than worrying about his origins or what's going to happen to him. That's why, to me, his species doesn't really matter. If you look at the prose, there's actually not really an opportunity for him to go into his dingo species. He has a well-established relationship with Flixer, he's already employed by the badger ... in the context of the scene, there's no reason to go into it (and now that I'm rereading, he does mention in the prose that he's a dingo, so I was wrong about that).

In the end, and I feel I should reiterate this because it might have gotten lost in this little discussion, but the reason I'm disappointed Rail didn't make it is because I felt a few people condemned him without giving him a chance. That they saw his species and immediately turned him off, and I think that's unfair to his writer.

It would have been interesting to see if things would have been different had he chosen a different species, probably otter or hare. It's entirely possible that Robert still would have had that edge over him.

I must say, I think you are the first reviewer who liked my app. The poor cooks seemed rather despised in the application process and I felt at first that I got in simply because I was the best of the worst. However, I've been informed that certain judges and readers now view me with more favor. :-)

I do hope I continue to bring enjoyment to you. Your thoughts thus far have been fun to read.

Ahh, I haven't read much of what everyone said about the cooks, I'm afraid. Between you and me, I liked your spunk and your reckless abandonment for consequences. It puts Vera in an incredibly interesting position social interaction-wise because she can be calm and collected on the outside, but you'll find out too late you've crossed her once you find the knife in your back, or, you know, your entire fort in flames.

Glad to hear people's opinions have changed for the better! That's always a nice feeling once you're out of the red zone. :3

[Sycamore]

Sycamore's Dream Team

Now, this is going to be difficult because there's absolutely no way I can do this without offending someone. Thankfully, the cast has already been decided so everything I say is worthless. As you all just saw, I love getting into discussions, so if anyone wants to share their thoughts on my choices I'm totally down with it.



Prisoner on Board

Nisky Banchibar

Tooley, at the risk of offending you first, I would have picked Nisky as my Prisoner. There's something about her tenacity that really calls to me. I've got a great sense of who she is, what makes her tick, and she does a great job displaying her character in the dialogue between herself and her grandson.

What I think I like about Nisky more than anything else, though, is that you know she would have been a difficult prisoner to deal with. Tooley and Bogdan don't have the heart Nisky does. They're easier to crumble under pressure and be the sad, pitiable character of the group, garnering my sympathy and making me want to hold and coddle them and tell them everything is going to be all right. Ironic that I say this, consider that was how I played Nyika, haha.

Nisky would have been great for some lip, a Brer Bear type prisoner who uses her wits to gain an advantage over her predicament. I'm not saying Bogdan would not have, but I don't think he would have been as bold or daring as Nisky could have been.



The Cook

Vera Silvertooth

Vera has this one. As I previously stated, I like her off-kilter frame of mind. Why does she burn the fort down to the ground? Who knows! It's a psychotic move and definitely something that makes me think twice about her. The potential for weird, unsettling cast interactions is off the charts with this one, and the fact that she's a cook? She could easily poison the entire store of larders and I don't think she would think twice about it. That's probably what happened the night she burned the fort to the ground.

Vera is dangerous and smart, which makes her even more dangerous, and that's what I like about her.



The Slavedriver

Chak Ku'rill

I had to take a minute to figure this one out. I almost chose Mari because I really like the idea of someone inexperienced and unable to control her slaves. I would have liked to have seen her grow and develop and come into her own. In the end, though, I determined that what I wanted out of Mari was going to be difficult to see. I was putting my own expectations on her character development, which mostly involved her slaves and I know the first thing you do in these contests is kill everyone off except the chosen ten. At that point, all she had for me was her accordion.

Chak, however, is already well established. He has a good relationship not only with his slaves, but also the rest of the corsairs. He's strong and commanding (not that Mari isn't strong, but he's got a more winning personality to me). He'd be great to put in the cast as a vermin otter, and I'm more drawn to the character interactions between him and the woodlander group.

While Mari would do well in a different story, I feel Chak is more engaging of a character to me.



The Quartermaster

Pasha Shapalashi

Pasha had a wonderful pitch to her, and her writing was top notch. I would have loved to see her interactions with a mammalian group, and I'm intrigued over her goals and personality.

As much as I love Vasily (whose prose I loved, don't get me wrong), Pasha was just a more interesting character, and I would have loved to see what she could have done. I heard she was searching for a place to lay her clutch of eggs, but I do have a question about that. If Andreas has been dead for four years, can she still lay? I missed this discussion and I'd like to learn more about it.



The Captain of the Vessel

Valencia

This was another tough toss up between Valencia and Ciera. Ultimately I decided on Valencia for a few reasons.

Ciera has great characterization. I really feel for her, and I love her humanity in the face of the trials and hardships these pirates are going through turning on each other in the wake of Captain Blade's death and his promised treasure.

With Valencia, it's always nice to have a superstitious beast on board, and I know they can be super fun to write. I think Valencia had more influence on me because she had mysticism on her side. Granted, I am incredibly biased if anyone read MOI, but I really like how Valencia played that scene and it's obvious why she would be a draw to me. I wonder how the others in the cast would have taken to her voodoo. Would they have believed her or chalked her up to an untrustworthy crazybeast?

Still, I'm glad Ciera made it in, because this was a strong category and Ciera's character is wonderful.



The Stowaway

Ciera

I love Ciera, more than life itself. I loved her pitch and I loved this scene. It was really heartwrenching to me. She knew exactly how to pull my heartstrings. She has so much to draw from, and I would have loved to see her handle things if she got in. Would she have ever returned to her mate and kits? Surely she had heard of Captain Blade's treasure and stowed aboard the ship to find it. This is what really grabs me. The demons of her past constantly plaguing her, driving her on. If she played on this throughout the story, it would have been one of the better arcs. If she died, I wouldn't know what to think. The fate of her family is nothing more than a dream, conjured by our own minds, because without a point of view telling us what's going on it's all left up to our own devices.

Ciera was one of my favorites because she had so much going for her.



The Healer

Crue Sarish

This one was really hard. I had a tough time deciding between Crue and Feorag. I loved Feorag because he seemed to know his stuff. The charcoal led me to this conclusion, because I know it's a cleansing agent, and he does more than simply use herbs and potions for healing, he adds a mysticism to his work which is a really nice touch.

Crue, however ? to me, I feel more drive. It's spoken in this line here:

On more than one occasion, she?d been tempted to arrange an ?accident? just for something to do. After all, it wouldn?t kill somebeast to give her nimble fingers a head injury to stitch.

I love that. It gives her a flaw and a vice that I'm interested in, that she's willing to do damage to progress in her art.

In the end, I'm simply more interested in her character and how she would interact with the other beasts. I understand Feorag's motivation very easily, but with Crue, she's got a pitch that I'm simply more eager to explore.



The Navigator

Rail Crimsarre

I would be remiss not to put him in my cast after what I've said about him, haha. Still, the other one I was most interested in was Robert, because he's got those three components that make a character, history, motivation, and aspirations.

In the end, forgoing species debate, Rail had one of my favorite writings out of the 30, and he would have been great to see interact with the rest of the cast.

I feel, after who've I decided right now, Rail would be a great pillar for the cast to stand on, someone who would look at the current situation and keep everyone grounded.



The Cabin Boy

Thaddeus Churchmouse

I've said this before, I love the guy's energy. I love his pitch, which is something I haven't seen much in these stories, an actual vermin prejudiced against vermin. I would have loved to see his interactions with the vermin crew, if he would have accepted who he was or denied it to the bitter end. It's almost like a case of nature vs. nurture. Could Thaddeus overcome his prejudices and accept who he is? Would the truth tear him asunder? How did he get like this in the first place? He's almost like ? a Veil?.

Tooley. Did you write Thaddeus??

If I had known Plink was going to make it, or if I had chosen her as my Stowaway (and I considered it for this reason), I would have picked Efith as my cabin boy. Why? Because his jrpg quest is brilliant. If he could win the heart of Plith then surely he will beat the game. That's one of the greatest side quests of this adventure I can imagine.



The Soldier

Filldering Dillwithers

Hisobe would have worked great as the treacherous backstabber, of which my cast is in dire need, but ?

I can't have a cast of Redwall characters without a true Redwall character. That's why Filldering wins my soldier category.

Filldering is by far the most traditional character in the entire bunch, and I love him for it. All I needed to see what his Eulalia to know it.

If I'm honest, in a community that's constantly pushing the bounds of Redwall and forcing our own headcanons to develop the world, a traditional character is always welcome. To the new folk, read a few books, refresh yourself on what made Redwall great, cater to that, and we will love you. It's no surprise to me Fildering is in this. He would have made my vote, too.



Looking back, seems like I made 4/10 of the cast, haha.

I hope no one took offense at my choices. You all made it in for a reason, and I'm proud of you for it. I can't wait to start the story. Every one of you has reason to be in it, and I know you'll spin a great yarn to read.

[Tooley Bostay]

Tooley. Did you write Thaddeus??

Haha! Nah, can't say I did. Though, hearing your reasoning, you make me wish I did! Maybe in a future contest I can do a "proper" Veil. =P

(And no offense taken! I really liked Nisky, too. Was sweating bullets, since the prisoner was such a tough category.)

[Captain Ciera Ancora]

Other Ciera love <3

I'm actually kind of sad that Stowaway Ciera never got to see the light of day. It's hard to say what she'd have actually done, but it would have depended almost entirely upon her interactions with other characters. More than likely she would have felt incredibly guilty for having abandoned her family, but she would also find herself enjoying life without being shackled down by all of that responsibility, and that would make it incredibly hard for her to want to go back. Very Henrik Ibsen, or possibly Shavian in nature. Would have made for an interesting conflict, I think.

[Xorvath]

Very Henrik Ibsen, or possibly Shavian in nature.

Yeah, if Ciera were Eliza in Prometheus' film adaptation (My Fair Lady), instead of leaving him like the character was supposed to and instead it was changed to a cutesy fetching of slippers, she would have just decapitated Henry Higgins, thus fulfilling the "just you wait" song :)

[Sycamore]

I have no idea what you guys are talking about. ( . .)

[Sycamore]

Just letting you guys know I'm still here. Crafting something up for my predictions on the top three before I crack the story good and proper, and this weekend I hope to get through Week One.

That will probably involve light notes and gif quips.

[Tooley Bostay]

Fantastic! Lookin' forward t' yer thoughts, mate! I'd also be interested in the first three rounds to know what your vote would have been, especially if it would be for someone still in the contest. Always good to hear a voter's thoughts!

[Opal]

I don't remember if I actually said in my review, but another reason I didn't feel compelled to vote for Rail was because he just seemed so detached from everything. Which I think would've provided some excellent comic relief in the short term, but I'm not sure how much longevity he'd have had with that schtick. I just couldn't see how he was going to fit in with this story in particular. I would read the crap out of a short story with him as the main character, though. Also, he really made no mention of having any navigator type skills (that I recall, anyway; it's been a while). Some sort of hint of a tie-in with the category would've been cool.

And then there's the fact that I simply liked Robert better. So nyeh. :P